Why do people…

I think it’s just people trying to keep the idea that midi controls are “not real DJing” and it’s only “real DJing” if you spent hundreds to thousands on the “decks”.

Rubbish.

Thinking about this and a ‘standard’ for controllers: I’m imagining tPioneer (or more likely) A&H coming out with a professionally built, sort of xone 4D advanced type mixer/controller which you can load your own mappings to (via sd card like the Pio CDJ units with cue points) and which is compatible with all major software. That will be the new standard. It might be up to the hardware manufacturers to come up with a standard for cue point files ect.

Or they might they come up with a small slimline yet professional controller setup up next to their mixer again compatible with all major software.

I think the crux for a new industry standard is some sort of ability for DJs to just load up their own mappings in to the controller/mixers in the clubs via a simple method, again like a SD card and then just plug in the laptop and rock!

Serato, Traktor, Pio, A&H and Denon should just have a meeting and set a standard format, just like a SIM card which is used by all carriers and manufacturers.

We think about this a lot. the jury’s out but it will definitely get EASIER to link your gear in to modern booth DJ gear, if not everything becoming STANDARD.

I started with the Hercules RMX, great controller and got the job done well. Recently upgraded to CDJ 2000’s and a DJM 900 Nexus. I understand the points made from each but I personally just feel more involved and connect with my CDJ’s then I ever did with my controller. These are all compatible with all of the current software out there and can do many similar things that todays controllers can on top of being used without any software, combined with software, or any set-up you really could imagine. In regards to adding sound effects, clips, and other additional effects with CDJ’s this may not be as easy as with a controller (or cheap) but it can be done. From the new rtx 1000 and a variety of other additional components you can go as crazy or basic as you would like. I personally find it easier to create build ups and breakdowns with my cdj’s but once again a personal preference.

As everyone has said, its not about what you use but the music that you play and create with your equipment. I have seen a variety of DJ’s use the standards, their own controllers, and some crazy customized set-ups and they each have their own strength and weaknesses. I suggest if you haven’t had a chance to use the CDJ’s or a controller give them both a try. Each person has their own preference (and price range) but they all have strengths and weaknesses and if set up correctly can reproduce the same feel and sounds.

I rarely post messages because I am more of a numbers guy (computer scientist and mathematician). Nevertheless, here are my opinions (and they are only my opinions) regarding this topic.

In terms of overall functionality, there is not much difference. However, for professional use, I must admit that I agree with the overall statements put forth by DJ Hessler. Although I love my DDJ-T1 and will continue to use it, I am planning to purchase a CDJ, or turntable DVS, setup this week.

I believe the reasons behind the perception that CDJs are better than controllers is attributed to three factors. One hurdle I believe controllers must overcome in the greater DJ community is appearance. Most controllers, in my opinion, look unprofessional and, yes, even toy-ish, in spite of their vast features and functionality. Small is not always better, in my opinion. For instance, it is similar to a rock band using a Bose speaker system in lieu of a stack of Marshall cabs at a concert. Yes, the Bose speaker system can get the job done, but the presentation will more than likely be unimpressive. When I am behind a DJ booth, I want to look like a DJ as well.

The second hurdle that controllers face is the low cost of entry does not filter out individuals who do not take the craft of DJing seriously. Unfortunately, the aforementioned segment of the controller user base vastly outnumbers the serious DJ controllerists, based on my observations (which are in no way a scientific study). In my opinion, this negatively affects the perception of all controllerist and controllers as well. In my short time returning to DJing, I have listened to numerous DJ sets on YouTube and other video sites. Consistently, the DJs who are utilizing CDJs or have invested in a decent DJ setup have the hottest mixes, in spite of the fact that the overwhelming majority of the controllerist are utilizing autosync. So much for the extra time available to do other things besides beat matching.

Lastly, the fact that CDJs can function without a computer is a major advantage in a professional setting for obvious reasons. Computers do and will breakdown, at some point.

As you might have noticed, the issues I pointed out above have little to do with the stage performance between controllers vs CDJs. The perception of why CDJs are better than controllers, in my opinion, mostly boils down to CDJs look more impressive and professional; the user base of CDJs is typically that of more committed and skilled DJs, which can indirectly lead to the assumption that CDJs are better; and the non-reliance of a computer to operate.

Nevertheless, at the end of the day, rock hard, keep learning and have fun with whatever tools you have at your disposal.

Xor, post: 18410, member: 1754 wrote: Yet the high cost of Vinyl and CDJ’s over the years has undoubtedly filtered out an immeasurable number of talented musicians. Your point is invalid – talent > all, high cost of planting your foot into what is initially a hobby simply pushes talented people away.

I do not think the point is invalid, as there are other options such as a controller. Talent has nothing to do with what you use, its how you use it. With that said, a lower cost point still attracts more less serious DJs to controllers that’s a fact. As you stated in your own words, the hobbyist. This is not to say that all controller users are hobbyist, by the way.

CDJs tend to be utilized by more serious DJs, due to the fact that it is presently standard club equipment and the investment cost is higher, which is also a fact. Not many people are going to spend the cash necessary to acquire CDJs unless they have money to blow or are dead serious about DJing.

The OP asked why are CDJs considered better than controllers. One reason has to due with the differences in overall user base. While there are good and crappy DJs in both camps (and I am on the crappy side, if you must know), due to the fact that the controller user base has a higher ratio of hobbyist and less serious DJs, it creates the perception (please note the word perception here and several times in my original post) that CDJs are better because they are used in professional clubs and by more than likely more skilled DJs.

I fail to see how this point is invalid when rationally discussing why CDJs are considered, whether rightfully or wrongfully, better than controllers.

DJ Retro Blaze, post: 18411, member: 1589 wrote: I do not think the point is invalid, as there are other options such as a controller. Talent has nothing to do with what you use, its how you use it. With that said, a lower cost point still attracts more less serious DJs to controllers that’s a fact. As you stated in your own words, the hobbyist. This is not to say that all controller users are hobbyist, by the way.

Except to enter the market with a controller you are still looking at a serious investment. Don’t all DJs start as a hobbyist? I’m pretty sure not many wake up one morning and decide to invest several thousand pounds/dollars in a new career.

To enter with a controller, most I would assume already have a laptop (£500), a good controller (£400 – S2), good monitors (£100), good headphones (£75). That’s a £1,100 investment for an initial hobby. It’s definitely not a low cost point.

I am a classically trained pianist, I have music training and music qualifications, yet my wife looked at me aghast when I mooted about entering the DJ world and the initial price point.

The other very important point is that someone can put their hands on, say, a Mixtrack Pro and learn the basics, learn to beatmatch manually if they so desire. What is the likelihood of someone wanting to start off being able to put their hands on vinyl, CDJ’s or DVS? Very very low is the answer.

I really cannot comprehend why these discussions and debates about technological evolution come up in every avenue, technology should be embraced, or we may as well go back to the days of black and white tv’s and CB radio!

my vote for a standard controller is on the hopefully soon to be released Vestax VCI – 480

It would have the 400’s build and layout, with the 380’s jogs and pads, then there would never be a reason to upgrade unless a slightly larger one came out with every led on the unit rgb for ultimate software feedback.