Home 2023 Forums DJing Software KeyFinders – Preferences?

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 17 total)
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  • #2047801
    Marco Solo
    Participant

    Look at Mixed in Key. DJ Techtools did a good test on several key detection programs and they found Mixed in Key to be the most accurate at 95%. On top of that, it also gives an energy level to give you another way to arrange your tracks. It does cost $58 though. There are also some free programs in there that do a decent job. You’d have to find out for yourself wether or not it’s worth it to purchase one of them or stay with free software. I went for Mixed in Key and have used it for quite a while.
    It is very hard to detect the exact key of a track by ear, it will probably take a few years to get it perfect if you even get that far.

    #2047802
    deathy
    Participant

    GREAT article, thanks!

    #2047814
    DJ Vintage
    Moderator

    +1 on MIK, the latest version added a few %-points of accuracy on the previous one.

    #2047828
    deathy
    Participant

    Yeah, it’s on my short list of investments… controller first.

    #2047841
    Lamid45G
    Participant

    Keyfinder is ok for now if you tight on budget, If im not mistaken it ranked above Traktor own key detection
    Plus freebie ish awesome ! ^_^

    #2047866
    deathy
    Participant

    Considerably above Traktor’s, yeah… the only thing OTHER than MIK that scored better was for the iPad, so for now, KeyFinder will be more than sufficient.

    I wonder how Melodyne compares?

    #2047868
    DJ Vintage
    Moderator

    LOL, you might want to give a little explanation of what Melodyne is (as a sound engineer I happen to know, but I am pretty sure it’s way out of most DJs scope 🙂 ).

    #2047895
    deathy
    Participant

    AH, heh. Sorry.

    Melodyne is freaking BRILLIANT SAUCE with an extra serving of AMAZING.

    It analyzes loops, or even entire songs, and pulls apart the notes, detects the keys, lets you rip out, for example, just the vocal bits, you can change the key of loops completely, from major to minor, shift it around, add additional notes using the actual sounds that the original artist was playing (their real voice or guitar strum), etc., etc., etc.

    It is SUPER COOL.

    It also does key detection, and I am inclined to think it would be the most accurate at guessing keys, but I haven’t done a comparison myself.

    It is worth pointing out that it is brilliant, but very complicated and a lot of work to use – it’s not a silver bullet. However, it is real nice when you are producing with loops and you have a loop you want to use that’s in the wrong key. However, it loses effectiveness for dense songs – it detects pitch ranges, NOT instruments, so if multiple instruments are playing the same note (say, A4), then it can’t rip them apart.

    #2048029
    deathy
    Participant

    Wow, Mixed in Key has a MAJOR downside – their DRM means that the application will not run:

    1. Without an internet connection, and
    2. Without their servers running.

    Item 1 is not a huge deal for me, but 2 – that’s ugly. It means that if they ever go out of business or decide to stop supporting the version that you’ve purchased, then your software goes bye bye.

    Now, to be fair, $58 US isn’t exactly a huge price to pay, so it’s not the end of the world, and they are at least very up-front about it so I do applaud them for that, but in terms of software politics, this really discourages me from wanting to give them my money.

    I guess I’ll just be happy that KeyFinder is as good as it is for now.

    #2048032
    DJ Vintage
    Moderator

    Here’s the thing though, and there is another thread on here where I go much deeper into this stuff, “as good as it is”, isn’t good enough imho.

    Let’s say an average night is 4 hours @ 15 tracks per hour = 60 tracks.

    With MIK you get 3 tracks that are not the right key. You put in something else when you hear it (when prepping the mix, or even when making your mini-playlists at home).
    With KeyFinder that number goes up to 14 tracks wrong. That is almost 5 (FIVE) times as many. It means every 4th track is off, instead of every 20th.

    To me that is the difference between an acceptable failure rate and frustration.

    Imho, if you enter 1000 tracks into your collection (a reasonable starting point) the software will have been worth it’s purchasing price. Any tracks after that, it’s pretty much been written off at that point.

    #2048034
    deathy
    Participant

    Yeah, but as I said, for me at least, it’s not the cost, it’s political – I am very disinclined to support DRM like this where we are dependent on the good will of the company responsible.

    I acknowledge that they do seem to be a decent company, and this is not about them specifically, but about the nature of the beast itself – I refuse to give my money to companies whose practices I cannot support. Some of those companies are generally good companies, and some aren’t, and I know that I am in the minority in this practice, but… it is what it is.

    I do admit that I’m tempted sometimes to give in, and this is one of those cases where I am sorely tempted, but I think that I would probably feel like I sold out if I do so.

    #2048035
    deathy
    Participant

    (But it is VERY tempting. *sigh*)

    #2048075
    Michael Risola
    Participant

    I like using “Keyfinder”. I find it easy to use. It’s not perfect but I’m ok with that. When I do come across a song that has the wrong key it forces my ears to do the work.

    #2048081
    DJ Vintage
    Moderator

    I personally can’t tell if the key is wrong in an absolute sense. So if Keyfinder would tell me key X and I played the song on its own, I couldn’t tell you if it was or wasn’t key X or Y.

    The only way to tell for me would be to mix this track into another track I KNOW (how?) to be in the key noted and hear that they are not the same. Not all that bad in a home environment while prepping mini-playlists, but not something I like in a live environment. As my numbers example showed, if you use Keyfinder it will happen 5 times as many as with files done with MIK.

    Obviously harmonic mixing is a tool, you should still trust your ears. Some songs sound bad together even if they are in compatible keys while other tracks work just fine even when they are supposedly not compatible. So Keyfinder or Mixed In Key should not be a substitute for listening and knowing your tracks and just plain old experimenting.

    It’s another reason to keep your collection modest, it gives you more time to play around with various combinations of tracks. The more 1-on-n options you have for each track, the more flexible you are in moving in any given direction.

    1-on-n means you have multiple options to connect to from the 1 you are playing. A 1-on-2 track for instance gives you only 2 possible next tracks that work well. A 1-on-10 track, obviously, would give you 10 different tracks to mix into. And the only way to find that out is to experiment. When I play a certain song, often my brain will start firing off a list of potential next tracks (even if I haven’t tried them together). It sounds like “oh, this tracks would be good or I could play this one know or I can play this track I haven’t played in like forever”. In those cases I don’t even look at the key, just drop a track in the deck, hit play and listen.

    #2048082
    DJ Vintage
    Moderator

    @deathy: While I actually share your sentiments, I have decided that being principal about it, is not hurting the companies (it would if everyone did it, but as with so many things, not everyone does, so companies don’t really care), but hurting me by limiting my choices.

    Another thing is that in these days of cloud, you’d be pretty much dead in the water. Cloud computing would not be possible for you (ALL your stuff is on some server(s), god only knows where). Same goes for dropbox, onedrive or any other online storage/sharing place. Or for streaming audio services. Or for any SAAS (Software As A Service = web-based applications) program.

    Not trying to convert you, please stick to your principles, just sharing my view on the matter.

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