Home 2023 Forums The DJ Booth In my element, I don't give a damn if you dance

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  • #39385
    DJ Vintage
    Moderator

    Hey,

    … do you consider yourself an artist … ?

    No, not as a musician. Apart from some unmentionable experimenting for about 2 hours I haven’t seriously touched producing anything.

    Yes, as in someone able to use predetermined building blocks (tunes), his personality and voice to create an everchanging mood with the intention of providing entertainment and pleasure. Some painters paint to tell a story, some painters paint to bring other people joy.

    Both are artists, but different kinds. I do feel the line between “true” DJs in the classical sense and the new breed of Producer/DJs is narrowing.

    A major difference, I think, is that people choose to go to a name DJ because they know exactly what they are gonna get, just like you would when you go to a regular performing artist. That is what you go to see, that is what you expect to get and that is what will make you happy.

    People that go to clubs, dancing bars and what have you, expect to be entertained in a different way. Here the DJ is less likely to disappoint, as there is less expectation. By the same token the DJ will be less admired, since he is not the focal point of the evening.

    In my current gigs, I could not live with myself if I had a night with nobody dancing because I wanted to do “my own thing”. People pay me to make their guests have a good time. On the other hand, if I had a large following who came to watch me specifically do “my own thing”, I would be hard pressed to do anything else because it would disappoint my fans.

    Hope that answer your question LOL.

    Greetinx,
    C.

    #39386
    NietzSKY
    Participant

    Don’t get me wrong, I don’t expect Angerfist to go over too well in a club in the heart of Washington DC. While I will take those gigs if I need the money (The one non-hard mix I put on the soundcloud is even called ”Rent’s Due”), I keep the location in mind and only embrace my element in an environment that allows.

    I’d really like to see more djs doing work and playing shows with metal/punk acts as a performer, instead of being confined to ”dance nights”. Who knows, maybe one day I’ll even see a turntablist in the percussion section of an orchestra XD.

    #39399
    Robby Luca
    Participant

    I get your point, but if your boss (the person that pays you) wants you to make people dance, then that’s your job lol If it’s a personal mix, then do whatever you want. I don’t do mixes to make people dance, I do it so they can listen and enjoy the music however they want.

    And if you post a mix with your “feelings” put in it, no one will guess because everyone interprets music differently. A song might mean one thing for me and something different for you.

    The only time I would understand if a DJ would play whatever he wants is when the crowd pay him to go see him specifically knowing what kind of performance he’ll give.

    #39416
    Dizzle
    Participant

    Even the international headline producer/djs play tracks they know will make people dance. I play mostly bass heavy EDM genres (Dubstep, Trap, Moombahton, D&B etc) with many of the tracks found at random on soundcloud and the like. So I only play songs that I love, but making me and other people dance are my first consideration. Picking a theme or feel for the set is important, promoters will pick you over another dj to play the time slot based on your ability to pick only an hour or two’s worth of music that helps to tell the theme or convey the feeling they are promoting that night AND makes people dance.

    There are lots of different kinds of Djs, even that ambient noise stuff has it’s place. Think about even a small gathering of friends is taken up a notch by adding some music. But, for me nothing beats the feeling of putting on that new track that you think is hot and dancing along with the whole crowd! Wether it’s 30 folks in a dingy remote bar with a tiny dancefloor and decent PA or a room full of hundreds of people with speakers to the ceiling the name of the game is telling your story while ensuring that the other people there with you remain included in your enjoyment.

    #39423
    NietzSKY
    Participant

    If I had to sum this little tirade/mini-journal post up, it’d just be don’t judge a book by its cover. The standard today seems to be that dj = dance, and somehow if you’re not making people dance you’re doing it wrong (although it is safe to say if you were hired specifically for that purpose and you aren’t delivering, you aren’t fufillin your job obligation). I’d like to see a little more avant-garde (in general, not the specific genre) coming out of the dj world; stuff that questions presuppositions and boundaries relative to the craft itself.

    #39430
    colione25@yahoo.com
    Participant

    I totally see where you are coming from and I know the feeling. You have your inner artist screaming. I feel you. I just moved here to DC from miami and after living in 7 different countries.I have actually been doing some research on how the craft is gone. Mediocrity has taken course and we are just settling. Yet, I want to know why people listen or gravitate to a sound. Why is there question about why music is so bland nowadays? I wrote this article a few months ago;

    Who are we? What’s the story behind our taste in music? Why do you like the type of dance you like?

    I would really love to do a poll and see what type of music people listen to and see if there are any correlations. For example, are those that like heavy metal, live bands, rock, etc, more inclined to liking electro, dark beats, hard-dance or even trance? Or those that enjoy R&B, do they prefer soulful house? I really don’t know and this has really interested me and prompted me to write this post. However, I wholeheartedly consider my taste to be underground- including some commercial sounding or ear candy as I would say, but (non-radio play).

    For a while now I have really been confused. Confused as to why people have a certain taste for music- in particular dance music. I must confess that as of recently, I have been undermining some of the latest music and its followers. I couldn’t seem to bring myself to understand why people gravitate towards to or could listen to for hours on end music such as; commercial dance pop, hard electro, dark house, dirty beats, underground tech house, techno or even hard non-vocal trance. The looping groovy tech-house that many “heads” enjoy with no vocals is a sound that I dislike with a passion. Even hard electro pop-, which I call interrogation music, drives me insane. I immediately cave in to those sounds. Anything highly commercial or dark, dry and loopy makes me leave the club even after paying $20 cover. Im a 15-85 on the “musical” spectrum of dance- rating from 1-100 (not too gutter, not too creamy)

    So I really must first apologize to any of those that I have undermined, offended, or even came across as someone who had “better taste” in music. Before I could ever to begin to understand other’s choice of sound, I had to acknowledge my history.

    And so I begin….

    Growing up in a half Haitian-half Jamaican family hood in Queens, NY, I was exposed early on in the 80s at the age of 7, while in an all black grade school, to the likes of Haitian Compas/Jazz, Jamaican Soca, Ray Barreto, Tito Puente, Julio Iglesias, Salsa, Air Supply, rock ballads, Lionel Richie, Cindy Lauper, Laura Branigan. My first cassette tapes were “Faith” by George Michael, LL Cool J, and “Purple Rain” by Prince that I had on repeat all day.

    I went to school with DJ Envy and lived on the same block as the original mixtape “king” DJ Clue of NY’s Power 105.1. Run DMC lived around the block from my school in Hollis, Queens.

    Moving to the suburbs of Alpine NJ and attending an all white junior high school, I rebelled and was defiant to any type of rock or what I called at the time “white music”. I was exposed to some Metallica, Red Hot Chilli Peppers, and Aerosmith but it didn’t appeal to me. I made friends with the only Puerto Rican brothers in town that were closer to my light-skinned color and kept in line with my traditional party hip-hop from Hot 97 like Third Base, Slick Rick, Naughty By Nature, EPMD, Onyx, old school reggae like Super Cat, Buju Banton, and Freeystyle.

    Entering a predominantly white/asian (korean) high school, I started getting into underground hip-hop but not gutter rap. I started djing in 1993 with vinyl records such as Gangstar, Fat Joe, Nas, Group Home, Big L, Jeru Da Damaja. I also started getting into house- but the Latin house from Strictly Rhythm and the ever so popular “follow me”, “Hot” by Soho, Night Crawlers- “Push the feeling on” and “Fired Up” by Murk (Oscar G/Falcon). I even started liking tribal latin house with vocals as I was around a lot of Dominicans and Puerto Ricans.

    I would be the first to have all the latest tracks and freestyles from Jay-Z, Nas, Capone N Noriega, Wu-Tang, AZ, Beatnuts. I recorded the NYC underground station WNY 891.1 with Sunset & Mayhem and 89.9 WKCR with Stretch Armstrong and Bobbito in 1993-95. I always was the first to have the exclusives out of my entire school. I still have Nas’s and Wu-tang’s freestyle cassette tapes. I use to drive all the way to the Bronx from NJ or to Jamaica Ave in Queens to pick up my Air Force Ones sneakers and latest dj mixtapes (cassettes) by Dirty Harry, Doggtime, Dj Camilo, Dj Clue, and Dj Envy. I knew all the drop dates and had all the exclusives. I was into dance R&B and hip-hop from Mary J Blige, Jermaine Dupree, 112, Method Man, Biggie, Diddy, and dancehall Reggae- Red Rat, Ninja Man, and early Sean Paul.

    I entered the Marine Corps at 19 and moved to Japan in 1998-2001 and started to dj dirty south hip-hop by cash money, Bow Wow, and reggae, for the local Japanese crowds but I didn’t really like dirty south rap. Fast forward to 2002, I moved to Latvia, a former Soviet Republic of Russia, to provide internal security for US Embassies as a Sergeant of US Marines and was then exposed to an all white European culture and dance radio stations 24/7. I was introduced to and by the help of my local DJ friends, gave me breaks at clubs where I played sounds such as disco, funky/deep house, Defected Records, Junior Jack & Kid Creme. “That Feeling” by DJ Chus of (Stereo-Productions) was my first deep house record. Latvia is also where I got a taste of Roger Sanchez’s “You Can’t Change Me”, Kings of Tomorrow, Dirty Vegas, and Shakedown “At Night”.

    Ironically, in 2004, while providing internal security for US Embassy Burma- off the coast of Thailand, and not liking the way hip hop was going, I did the full transition to house. Even though being from NY, the KTU anthem music from Deborah Cox, Thunder Puss remixes didn’t move me. I really enjoyed mostly Hed Kandi/Ministry of Sound UK lounge, progressive, Dan Maciano, Dj Gregory, deep house like the early stuff by Axwell, Moloko, David Penn, Copyright, Chus & Ceballos (Echoes From Duruma). Jerry Ropero & Denis The Menace. I was more into that sexy latin percussive groove and uplifting funky groovy house that went well in thailand and where I was able to play at the Bed Side Supper Club in Bangkok, off of Sukhumvit road.

    2005- I moved to Miami and met with Johnny Ramirez who had a similar sound to me and Patrick M, who worked at Chopin Hagen (my video interview with Patrick M coming soon). Together we did all the early Space days with Roland, Roger Sanchez, Eric Morillo, – Sundays with Biz Martinez at Amica. Johnny and Patrick gave me my first break in Miami to open guest dj at Nikki Beach.

    2007 -I landed my first and only weekly residency at Segafredo Lincoln Rd in South Beach being a cop by day and dj by night- and still there til today. There, I have been exposed to many cultures so I now include vocal house from various countries such as Romania, Russia, Brazil, Italy, Bulgarian-melodic deep progressive house in my sets. Having lived in 7 different countries allowed me to make deeper connections with people.

    I no longer listen to hip-hop here in Miami but rather to 80s, 90s hip-hop, and AM radio. I only listen to hip-hop when I visit family in NY/NJ. Most of the time I am listening to my latest house tunes on my mp3 players programming my sets for my radio show. My taste for house is all (non-radio play) sexy progressive, Latin, melodic tech, euro dance, thumping Afro-Tribal, disco, nu-disco, and Uplifting Funky. I have never liked slow R&B so maybe that is why I don’t really like preachy soulful house.

    Perhaps of my loyalty to my sound is why my past favorite djs like Eric Morillo and Roger Sanchez that took me on musical journeys hitting almost every subgenre of house- have lately and GREATLY disappointed me while playing in the United States. Roger to me is all noise in the US and I can’t listen to back-to-back anthems by Morillo. Danny Tenaglia has never interested me at all- but why? I’m in search of the answer.

    Again, do those that like heavy metal, live bands, rock, etc, have a tasty ear for electro, dutch dirty house, dark beats, hard-dance or even trance? I really don’t know if we will ever know the answer to that unless a giant poll is conducted. But all in all I do find it interesting and do apologize for being a bit closed minded in the past.

    Having really taken the time to sit and put it all on paper, I now see why I like the music I do.

    #39434
    NietzSKY
    Participant

    Thanks for the great response halfamazing. Funny thing, really, for I actually include Russian house/electro, Buglarian ethno-house and Romanian house into my sets when I play house-parties during the summer; lots of my friends who come over are eastern European, and they get a kick out of popular house/electro over here mixed with some of the artists from back home.

    Now, I’m not a huge hard trance fan, but a lot of hardstyle music the product of a hardcore/hard trance merger. My favorite opera is Gotterdammerung (4th installment of the Ring cycle by Wagner), and my favorite musical period is the Baroque. In the classical world, I tend to gravitate towards more ”powerful” sounding music. I don’t know if there is some deeper Freud-esque revelation in my selection of music, or whether I simply enjoy what I enjoy, but the harder sounds of techno I feel are the closest we have to the emulation of the music of the periods in which I enjoy.

    Allow me to explain; the bulk of the harder metal sounds (stuff that makes disturbed sound like new kids on the block) is generally very aggressive on percussion, and requires a great level of skill to perform on any instrument. HOWEVER, melodically speaking I find most of it to be incredibly lacking (usually a 4 chord arpeggiated progression or a very predictable modal scale made to sound more-complex through a use of alternative picking). I find these songs very boring and predictable. With the harder sounds of techno, however, there’s an entirely new element that can’t yet be understood in terms of tonal theory. This brings back the surprise in music for me, when I don’t know what sounds are going to be used in instrumentation and how they are going to mix with the chord structure/melodic progression. It’s as-if I’ve discovered a new world full of excitement, whereas I find most pop/metal to be incredibly weak in terms of poetry, boring in terms of structure, and a lesser variant of the art that has been with us for the last 400 years. In addition, harder techno generally tends to use completely synthesized synthetic sounds that are quite different from any other genre. The hardstyle kick in particular I believe is genius; I only wish I could have been there for the first.

    #39466
    henley
    Participant

    i’m no artist. i get creative with other people’s art.

    #39496
    NietzSKY
    Participant

    henley, post: 39622, member: 8952 wrote: i’m no artist. i get creative with other people’s art.

    I look at DJing and photography in similar lights. A lot of photographers don’t create the environments they shoot (some do, similar to how some DJs produce/remix), but their art is contained within the perspective they provide.

    #39517
    DJ BRUAEL
    Participant

    NietzSKY, can you give me the name of a track on youtube I can listen to with this “hardstyle kick”? I am very intrigued now.

    Also if you give me an example of a “dutch house” song I’d appreicate that as well! Trying to diverisfy from RnB/HipHop and more into Moombahton/Trap and more Bass Music.

    #39529
    NietzSKY
    Participant

    There are 4 different types of hardstyle kicks: the gated kick, filtered kick, reverse bass kick and the nustyle kick.

    This would be a nustyle kick;[media=youtube]wRX0HrJ2qyg[/media]

    The basic premise is that you turn your kick drum into the bass line; these type of kicks require a good amount of EQing, distortion, and layering. A good kick can take weeks to tweak to get it to sound just right.

    #39537
    Alex Wray
    Participant

    DJ BRUAEL, post: 39673, member: 8505 wrote: Also if you give me an example of a “dutch house” song I’d appreicate that as well! Trying to diverisfy from RnB/HipHop and more into Moombahton/Trap and more Bass Music.

    Sorry to butt in, but here’s a small paragraph that might help you

    wrote: Dutch house, often nicknamed dirty Dutch, is a style of electro house that originated in the Netherlands.[COLOR=#0b0080][21][/COLOR] It is primarily defined by complex rhythms made from Latin-influenced drum kits, a lower emphasis on basslines, and squeaky, high-pitched lead synths. Influences on the subgenre include Madchester, hip hop, Detroit techno, and other urban styles of music.[COLOR=#0b0080][22][/COLOR] Related artists include Afrojack, Chuckie,Hardwell, R3hab, Sidney Samson, Switch, and Tiësto.

    #39540
    J-Zed
    Participant

    Halfamazing, post: 39586, member: 9258 wrote:
    Again, do those that like heavy metal, live bands, rock, etc, have a tasty ear for electro, dutch dirty house, dark beats, hard-dance or even trance? I really don’t know if we will ever know the answer to that unless a giant poll is conducted. But all in all I do find it interesting and do apologize for being a bit closed minded in the past.

    I can help a bit with that, I come from a very heavy metal background. I spent my teens and early 20s listening to many different varities of heavy metal from American Thrash to Finnish Melodic Death and Norwegian Black Metal. When I started moving towards dance music in general I started off with old school drum and bass from the mid 90s, I fell in love with LTJ Bukem’s mixsets even though they were already over 10 years old. From there I slowly worked my way into the dark sounds of tech house and techno. I do enjoy a variety of styles from melodic, bouncy, funky house, techno and so on but my true love is for the late night sound designed for a quite a specific target audience.

    NietzSKY, post: 39590, member: 4553 wrote: Allow me to explain; the bulk of the harder metal sounds (stuff that makes disturbed sound like new kids on the block) is generally very aggressive on percussion, and requires a great level of skill to perform on any instrument. HOWEVER, melodically speaking I find most of it to be incredibly lacking (usually a 4 chord arpeggiated progression or a very predictable modal scale made to sound more-complex through a use of alternative picking). I find these songs very boring and predictable. With the harder sounds of techno, however, there’s an entirely new element that can’t yet be understood in terms of tonal theory. This brings back the surprise in music for me, when I don’t know what sounds are going to be used in instrumentation and how they are going to mix with the chord structure/melodic progression. It’s as-if I’ve discovered a new world full of excitement, whereas I find most pop/metal to be incredibly weak in terms of poetry, boring in terms of structure, and a lesser variant of the art that has been with us for the last 400 years. In addition, harder techno generally tends to use completely synthesized synthetic sounds that are quite different from any other genre. The hardstyle kick in particular I believe is genius; I only wish I could have been there for the first.

    I’m not gonna get really into the whole metal topic but as for your words on melodically speaking, if you’re interested in melodic metal bands I’d suggest looking in the melodic death and melodic black metal genres. My favourite metal band, Emperor was one of the bands at the forefront of black metal in general and were one of the first to go start using background synths with their music. Children of Bodom (earlier albums, they got less melodic with time), Dimmu Borgir and some other bands I can’t remember (I’m at work) are also notable bands that are more or less along the same style.

    #39542
    NietzSKY
    Participant

    Dutch house (also known as dirty house) is a genre of house that emphasizes the higher frequencies after drops. It usually has a squeaky/lazer-beam esque sound that spans the entirety of the drop.

    [media=youtube]UkSZDWkRob0[/media]

    When I play clubs, I like to mix a lot of dutch house and electro; the music is still fun to shuffle to in the end.

    #39543
    NietzSKY
    Participant

    J-Zed, post: 39696, member: 1486 wrote:
    I’m not gonna get really into the whole metal topic but as for your words on melodically speaking, if you’re interested in melodic metal bands I’d suggest looking in the melodic death and melodic black metal genres. My favourite metal band, Emperor was one of the bands at the forefront of black metal in general and were one of the first to go start using background synths with their music. Children of Bodom (earlier albums, they got less melodic with time), Dimmu Borgir and some other bands I can’t remember (I’m at work) are also notable bands that are more or less along the same style.

    When it’s done right, it’s done right (don’t get me wrong). I am still a fan of Children of Bodom, Necrophagist, and other stuff of the nature (I also enjoy a lot of power metal). Borgir I was never impressed with, though my friend swore by them, Lamb of God and Black Dahlia Murder. Even with Bodom, however, if you analyze their progressions, it’s a lot of very basic simple arpeggiated chord progressions, made to sound complex through the use of alternate picking. Solos, while requiring technicality, are usually just scale and mode grinds.

    The problem for me is that there’s a difference between melodically/harmonically complex music, and music that requires a great deal of technicality to play.

    Chopin’s 28 20, for example, is only an intermediate piano piece in terms of technical proficiency; however, the chord inversions/variations he uses are fairly atypical; he manages to create a seamless melody, embrace more than a simple 3-4 chord progression, and demonstrate his vast knowledge of chromaticism.

    NietzSKY, post: 39698, member: 4553 wrote: Dutch house (also known as dirty house) is a genre of house that emphasizes the higher frequencies after drops.

    [media=youtube]UkSZDWkRob0[/media]

    When I play clubs, I like to mix a lot of dutch house and electro; the music is still fun to shuffle to in the end.

    [media=youtube]EsKwtXgFo24[/media]

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