Home 2023 Forums The DJ Booth If my FaceBook page is dead, am I doomed as an online DJ?

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  • #33396
    DJ Menno
    Participant

    While I enjoy posting my mixes for my friends, for promoters my mixcloud is essentially a visit card. If someone’s interested in having a DJ in a club or pub, there’s a QR code on my visit card that links to my facebook /mixcloud page. But I like to have a chat or a drink with the person I’m giving my card to, make sure there’s some real contact.

    This said, social media has an easy rule. The more they click, the more they click. Get 50 friends to click “like” on your page and it will go up the ranks in the search engines. My mixcloud followers are exponentially increasing. The more I have, the more come listening. And you’ve got to participate : comment on other posts, other dj’s walls, soundcloud productions which are in your style of music, and you’ll build a niche from where you can be visible on the web…

    #33408

    How do you generate an online audience that will faithfully follow you online?

    To generate an audience you need to build reach and be consistent in producing content. You need people to talk and sharing your content. But you have to think like a content creator and not like most DJs who are more concerned about posting mixes for self-promotion and showing off their skills (like me – LOL!!). If you’re going for a pure play online approach like a radio station then you have to think like a radio station. Music is your content. I know many peeps who listen to mixcloud or spotify or other streaming audio programs to hear music they can’t find on regular radio.

    What I like about DJ Homei’s idea is that he is thinking about his mixes as content. It’s like how a web site would think about putting up stories about whatever. If that’s something his peeps want cool.

    How would I build his audience?
    1) I would make a simple web site and brand it. There’s tones of free ones out there. This is helpful to be found outside of FB using search to create awareness.
    2) Use sites like Mixcloud or whichever to post your music. With Mixcloud you can link your posts with tools like WordPress for example.
    3) Create an accompanying FB page. Not your personal one. You need one where people not in your network can find you also. And your listeners may not be interested in your goofy kitten pictures, or where you took your girlfriend last night etc. Again Mixcloud has an API or a way to link content to FB.
    4) Start a Twitter account. And link Mixcloud to that too.
    5) Spread the word (online or offline).

    The idea is to create content on a variety of platforms that will help increase your reach across networks. This way you’re leveraging your friends and your friend’s friends etc.

    If this is Homei’s approach he will need to produce content on a frequent basis that his audience begins to rely on it. You can’t post one this week and not post another for two months. People will forget about you. The golden rule to build an audience on YouTube is to produce content frequently and share it.

    I could go on. But those are some basics. Like I said in earlier posts it is a lot of work.

    #33411
    Anonymous
    Inactive

    Good points above. I would also recommend to put together a DJ/producer collective, if you are 2-3 or more working for the same goal, the production amount will be far higher. Plus you could spread the boring work, social network updates et rest, across multiple members. A good example is the Reset! collective from Milan.

    #33424
    D Homei
    Participant

    Sorry if i came off as aggressive that wasnt my intention…I know i can get a little forceful with my posts lol.

    That’s fine. It’s just you being young, and full of piss & vinegar. I wouldn’t survive as a teacher if I didn’t secretly love it, although I sometimes bear the brunt of it. BTW, I’m not 20 yrs older than you . . . not quite 😮

    How would I build his audience?

    @Suga*Foot: Super big thanks, more on that in a moment.

    Anyway, I do actually have an existing reputation to build on, but maybe not the way a young whippersnapper like Hee Won Jung :p might think of: my network of creative professionals. The road to my MTV animation gig started when I talked about Jill Scott with a woman who eventually became a VP of promos. I’ve got about 20 years of conversations like that. In all my years playing music at work (pre-iPod era) I never once had anybody complain about my song choices, even when the offices were rife with bitter office politics.

    So I’m hoping my network of friends might think something like: “I remember Mike, he was that cool guy I worked with and he always talked about dance music. He’s got a show? I’ll bet he’s got some good music I could listen to while I’m filling out these boring f***ing reports.”

    This might be an admittedly romantic idea for the show. It’ll probably take a long, long time to even get my colleagues to tune in once. By that time, there should be several shows posted. Then they can realize I’ve got some good stuff for them. If I get just enough responses to I know I’m not howling at the moon like a coyote in the desert, I’ll consider it a success. And it’ll give me an outlet for my DJing.

    I’m generally intending to follow the super helpful advice Shuga*Foot has outlined. Although 1% is a depressing metric, it’s good to know what I’m up against. And I need to focus on specialty sites more, too. This thread, and DDJT in general, is a great example of reaching people who share similar interests.

    But to bring things back to my original question a bit: I’m still trying to get my head around the inverse logic of social media. It really seems to reward garbage over substance and content. There’s some weird voodoo going on, even if you’re doing all the proper (and hard) work. Right now FB seems like ‘up’ is ‘down’ and ‘down’ is ‘up.’

    For example: one of my FB friends actually does something everybody has fantasized about: He never settled down and travels all over the world. He’s also a very bright artist. Needless to say, his FB feed is filled with amazing photos from exotic locales every month. But even he was getting tired of FB apathy. So he tested with a simple 2 word post: “Carrot Cake.” THAT bit of nonsense got more response than all his worldly exotic travels. He decided to quit posting on FB after that.

    Although I’m starting to figure it out, how you phrase things and the manner you present and/or ask for a call to action in your posts really seems to matter. I’d love to hear more about these subtleties of posting, although I suppose it’s the million dollar question.

    I see some people try to start a discussion but really, they’re just showing off how smart they are. Other people are inexplicably popular: they post “Wazzzup with Ketchup?” and get 20 enthusiastic replies. Other discussions just dissolve into shouting matches and scare people away. I have one friend who can’t realize his posts are clingy pleas for sympathy, and he’s scaring people off. God knows what I’m doing wrong.

    @Shuga*Foot: If you have some good suggestions for further reading, articles and/or research I’m all ears. There’s a mountain advice out there that’s little more than glorified ponzi/pyramid schemes. Unlike music, I don’t know where to dig for the gems on this matter.

    #33431
    Terry_42
    Keymaster

    Good emotional discussion. I agree in many things with what Hee says.

    /moderator mode on

    However guys, please watch the language a bit, especially “bad words”, I would like to keep this thread going and not close it down for bad language and harsh behaviour… Thanks for your understanding.

    /moderator mode off

    #33440
    D Homei
    Participant

    Already modified out my “F-Word” sorry.
    And just to make sure . . . “Full of Piss and Vinegar” is actually meant as a compliment and not to be harsh.
    Its a bit of US slang for youthful enthusiasm and being full of energy. Hopefully that was clear in the full context of my post.

    #33464

    But to bring things back to my original question a bit: I’m still trying to get my head around the inverse logic of social media. It really seems to reward garbage over substance and content. There’s some weird voodoo going on, even if you’re doing all the proper (and hard) work. Right now FB seems like ‘up’ is ‘down’ and ‘down’ is ‘up.’



    WORD! The unfortunate reality is that most people live pretty mundane lives. And FB has become this place where people try not to be boring. That’s where social falls apart. So all you see is a stream of garbage where mundane people respond to mundane things. If you want How-To guides to social media and online marketing etc. Mashable.com has a lot of useful information. FB also has help guides for people who want to build pages and grow their audiences. YouTube also has interesting guides for the content partners.

    #33470
    Hee Won Jung
    Participant

    Shuga*Foot, post: 33620, member: 2922 wrote:

    WORD! The unfortunate reality is that most people live pretty mundane lives. And FB has become this place where people try not to be boring. That’s where social falls apart. So all you see is a stream of garbage where mundane people respond to mundane things. If you want How-To guides to social media and online marketing etc. Mashable.com has a lot of useful information. FB also has help guides for people who want to build pages and grow their audiences. YouTube also has interesting guides for the content partners.

    See and thats the biggest issue with sites like Facebook. No one really cares about whats happening…just stuff that really interests them. Having a radio show…while it may be interesting to the select few…is really…REALLLY boring to others. The problem i see with an online radio station…and im totally at fault for this is that If the song that is on right at that moment im not interested in I wont stay on that online radio station. We live in the age of NOW and if we dont like something we change it NOW.

    The main thing that really catches me when i listen to online radio/mixes is who its coming from…and more specifically I know that the radio shows i listen to are going to have the most latest songs on it so it is a tool for me utilize so i can add music to my collection.

    Listen to In the Air with Morgan Page, In the Chamber with Revolvr, The Lazy Rich Show, and Burn the Fire Radio with Cold Blank…these all are more toward standard radio where songs are announced and it is all Brand new Music that has just been released…complete with Tracklistings so i know what exact song is being played.

    Unless you can do something different, and new…maybe something to get the people you are trying to get involved somehow, like guest mixes of local djs, give aways, make t-shirts and have people walking around with them. Stickers, SOMETHING to get the word out to the masses, i fear that you will be putting in a huge amount of effort with very little to show for it.

    Oh and yes i am full of piss and vinegar…I’m our companies Pitbull LOL 😀

    #33495
    D Homei
    Participant

    Mashable.com has a lot of useful information.

    Listen to In the Air with Morgan Page, In the Chamber with Revolvr, The Lazy Rich Show, and Burn the Fire Radio with Cold Blank…

    Thanks for both these tips, I’ll check them out.

    If the song that is on right at that moment im not interested in I wont stay on that online radio station. We live in the age of NOW and if we dont like something we change it NOW.

    I’m not targeting this type of person, and practically speaking there’s no targeting except lucking into the .001% thing somebody wants exactly at that moment. I’m not sure what I can do to fight internet-driven cultural ADD, that’s a whole ‘notha conversation. Perhaps paying attention for extended periods of time is a generational thing.

    But I really, really, really love internet radio and its poor cousin, online mix streams. There’s just something about having somebody put on a quality selection of music that pleases and surprises you. And thanks to online, I can completely avoid bad commercial music. This really helps me focus when I’m doing some challenging work (In my case, tricky 3D computer animation). It helped me get through grad school. I would put on KCRW and/or ETN.fm listen to it for 6-12 hours straight. It helps me write, too. I can’t be alone in this.

    Unless you can do, SOMETHING to get the word out to the masses {emphasis mine}, i fear that you will be putting in a huge amount of effort with very little to show for it.

    Again, I’m not trying to reach the masses, just enough people to know I’m not braying at the moon like a coyote in the desert. Hopefully, this will be a my decent circle of friends both online and off. If it helps get the occasional local gig, even better. Especially if I don’t have to lurk around the clubs like Mr. Creepy Old Guy.

    Hopefully, once I get into the groove of posting, making a good 1hr show will only take an evening/afternoon of my time. This seems like a appropriate amount of time for any hobby people take seriously. And I believe having a hobby is a healthy thing. Compared to the effort needed for animation projects, its pretty small. My real enemy is my busy professional work schedule. But we’ll see.

    BTW, I know I can’t keep up on North American slang out here in Hong Kong, but do people still use WORD! (?) I thought that went out in the 90s.

    #33522
    Hee Won Jung
    Participant

    DJ Homei, post: 33651, member: 5649 wrote: But I really, really, really love internet radio and its poor cousin, online mix streams. There’s just something about having somebody put on a quality selection of music that pleases and surprises you. And thanks to online, I can completely avoid bad commercial music. This really helps me focus when I’m doing some challenging work (In my case, tricky 3D computer animation). It helped me get through grad school. I would put on KCRW and/or ETN.fm listen to it for 6-12 hours straight. It helps me write, too. I can’t be alone in this.

    Whats one mans trash is another mans treasure. I understand now where you are coming from. I dont agree with it but i understand. Myself i always have the biggest possible outcome and do everything i can to try and make it happen. I like to aim super high that way when it only ends up being like 100 out of every 1000 i have still at least connected with those 100 people. If you only aim your market at 100 and only 10 tune in, i personally would find it a little deflating.

    DJ Homei, post: 33651, member: 5649 wrote:
    Especially if I don’t have to lurk around the clubs like Mr. Creepy Old Guy

    Well ya see this is where you took things to literally. Im assuming you are around the 40-50s age with the 20 years older comment…so why not find social venues where people of this age hang out? Be social in Martini Bars, Gentlemens clubs, etc. You say you like the lounge music and the laid back stuff so why not go and hit the venues that promote that type of stuff. Dinner clubs, Cigar Lounges, Whiskey Bars, you are in Hong Kong…and you mean to tell me that you cannot get people to connect with you in the place where there are the most people in the world?

    Don’t try and stick to strickly under under underground. You say you dont want “those” types of people…but isolating yourself to the .05% isnt really going to get you anywhere and you will be as your OP says “dead in the water”

    #33524
    aaron altar
    Participant

    If I follow correctly Hee thinks we all want to play for people who want to get drunk and dance and DJ Homei wants to play for people who want to listen to the music. I’m in the latter group. I’m also too old with too many responsibilities to go clubbing on any kind of a regular basis (and I’m only 35). Some of us just love a certain style of music and want to share it. Good luck to you sir in your endeavor.

    #33527
    Hee Won Jung
    Participant

    No im not saying that all people want to get drunk and dance to music…although that is where a large part of the money for the industry comes from. Most artists dont make a ton of money off their songs…but off concerts, shows, events etc. is where the biggest portion of their funds come from. Music is Social…there is no doubt about it. It creates conversations, emotions, and a community. You need to engage the people you want to captivate…and sending a facebook message, or posting stuff on forum boards and peoples walls will just be ignored.

    How many of you on here that have facebook…actually read all the stuff that comes through the newsfeed? You may have 3000 friends…but out of those how many actually engage you? How many just hit like on a status and just move on throughout their day. How many of you actually comment something that is useful other than “omg thats so funny” or “LOL i love that cat”

    In the end getting a fanbase is a lot like trying to pick up a girl at the bar. Youll probably talk to hundreds…and get maybe 10 numbers…out of those 10 you will be lucky if you get 1 or 2 that actually goes out with you.

    #33567
    D Homei
    Participant

    @rjWhite41: Thanks for the good wishes. I think you’ve summed up my intentions pretty well, I am aiming for people who listen more than dance. But, I think you’re being a bit hard on Hee Won Jung. BTW, I love spinning for people who get drunk and dance, as well, I did it two weeks ago, and it was great.

    Seems like there’s two issues here:
    1) DJing after age 35,
    2) Transcending the gimmicky nature of the internet.

    On point #1:
    I meant “Mr. Creepy Old Guy” as a self-depreciating joke, not because I thought you were taking shots at my age. Yes, I’m in my mid-forties. I don’t want to limit myself because of my age. I’ve heard there’s a DJ here in HK who’s 60, looks like a Kung-Fu master, and spins amazing techno!

    But I’m realistic. The opportunities to DJ where crowds go crazy all night to bangers will become less and less, especially as I head towards my 50s. When I turned 30, I noticed a huge shift in the role of music at parties. Instead of complimenting my music then dancing, friends would compliment the music, and then get some wine and cheese. 🙁

    No matter how crazy good I am as a DJ (and I’m confident I can rock/destroy right now) promoters and crowds would just rather have a cocky young guy on the decks than an older guy who’s happy with his wife and day job.

    And the feeling goes both ways. Now that I’ve become settled in my personal life, I see how much clubs and lounges are filled with people who are still finding their way. If you’re not going to a club to get laid, get high or get attention – seems to me there’s not much left except music.

    I wanted to be married and settled down at 35, and it took me 10 hard years and relocating to Asia to just find it. So I’m a little uneasy to return to the bar/lounge world. Plus, even though my tastes are mellow, I still like the bangers, too. Still, I’ll try lounges before judging.

    Not sure what the path is for older DJ’s – seems like each has to find their own way. In my early 20s I couldn’t even imagine I’d still be into EDM in my 40s. I thought I’d be sipping brandy listening to Vivaldi wearing a smoking jacket or something. Phil seems to have found his lounge paradise in Southern Spain, D-Jam seems happy blogging, DJ Stone Crazy seems happy rocking clubs regularly. Maybe my path is a radio show.

    On point #2: (and God this is turning into a long post)
    I agree music is definitely a social form of engagement. I think I’m aiming for a more quiet form of social engagement. The internet is really the most practical way to do this, but the medium rewards the superficial.

    I’m thinking of many of my animation colleagues who are great illustrators. They can spend huge chunks of their time on:
    1) Their masterpieces.
    2) Convincing galleries to showcase their masterpieces for a very narrow group of people.
    3) Creating a web presence to get their work noticed.

    But #3 takes away from #1 because they have to fill their blog with regular updates and that means rough sketches instead of polished illustrations. I think the solutions around this dilemma have been discussed plenty – Shuga*Foot has great suggestions in particular. (mashable.com is great.)

    But whenever I feel like ranting like a crotchety old man about the internet, I realize I was able to relocate to Asia and find my wonderful wife through the internet. And listen to great music all day long. The web is amazing for finding your niche interests. Hopefully, I’ll be one of those people reaching web listeners listening to music at work or study. I think there’s lots of people out there.

    #33585
    Ess Jay
    Member

    If you start doing a radio station let people know on here. Sounds like your really passionate and I’d be interested in listening if / when you start it up. Just do what you enjoy.

    #33590

    I lost track of the direction of this dialogue. Homei, in this world of 7 billion peeps, there’s room for your idea. And many ways to do it purely online. It’s been proven. I’ve been doing it for nearly 20 years. If that doesn’t date me I remember buying “Can You Feel It” on vinyl in ’86. And I still love house and DJing too! Age is not a limit. Be clear of your goals and go for it.

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