Affordable rotary mixer?

Thanks for the heads up, I was disappointed when they scrapped the v1 release of this mixer.

@DJ Vintage – the two standout features that I see on the more desirable rotary mixers are;
1). adjustable crossover (see RANE for example)
2). they are often analog and/or highly quality components (and hella expensive as a result)

But before anyone points it out for me, none of either of those is guaranteed just because it’s a rotary mixer. The A&H 92R is a lovely piece of kit, but doesn’t offer an adjustable crossover (that I know of!).

Having said that, I like the look of this little gadget primarily because of point #1 above, can’t wait for the review on DDT!

You are of course right – i was thinking of isolators not crossover, the Rane 2015’s additional controls confused me!

My own experience with the isolators on a few (limited) mixer’s I’ve played with, i get the sense they can add a harmonic that can fatten out bottom ends and otherwise colour the sound in interesting ways. YMMV

As for the analog vs. digital mixer piece, I was specifically referring to the difference between DSP based mixers where (if I understand correctly) the bus summing is done in software versus analog where it’s done “on the wire” as it was.

When it comes to playing on either, i have to concur, mixing on a rotary takes some getting used to and I am not completely sure what all the fuss is about, other than giving hipsters a boner.

Having said that, I do get a lot of people at my shop asking me to supply them with rotaries and it would be great to have options that aren’t all in the $3,000 range!

Thanks again for replying, the nice thing about the discussion group is that it hangs around long enough to benefit many.

I think that ‘analogue mixer’ is interpreted in 3 different ways by people (and it shouldn’t be so):
1. Analogue meaning it has a physical form as opposed to digital which is physicalless and ’emulated by software’
2. Analogue meaning it has sound card built in
3. Analogue meaning it has 100% analogue signal path (no DACs!)

From what I know and understand an analogue mixer is when the signal is not converted into digital form by DACs only (so the option number 3) – taking this standpoint, most of the mixers on the market are digital – all Pioneers are digital, most of Rane is digital (even rotary MP2014/5 is fully digital) and a few exceptions come from A&H (e.g. one 23 and 43 but db2/4 are digital).
General consensus is that analogue mixer sounds better than digital architecture.

Rotary vs fader?
Rotary ‘mix level’ knob is supposed to feel easier to control. Why? This is to do with human’s hand anatomy – hand/ forearm is constructed in a way that makes it easier to make movements which are circular than linear. For example: it is easier for us to draw a circle then 100% straight line – we are not robots 🙂
Also, the other factor with knobs on rotaries is the major one: you can rest your hand on them when using – you cannot rest your hand on a fader.
Of course, everyone likes different things and if something works for someone then….go for it! 😉

greetinx 🙂

hey mate

I was just saying what I have noticed that people refer to as ‘analogue mixer’ – I have noticed these three instances and imho the 3rd situation is ‘really true’. If you have DACs in the mixer then the sound gets digitized, simple.

Most rotary mixers on the other hand are analog – they don’t have DACs. The new RAne 2014/2015 is the odd one out – it’s rotary + designed to look like vintage (i.e. analog era) but fully is fully digital mixer – sounds very very flat and transparent – not my cup of tea at all, although amazing mixer in its own right.
What you have to bear in mind is….if an analog/rotary mixer is IC based or is fully discrete. Discrete signal path distorts the signal less therefore is preferable. What I am trying to say is that analogue mixer which is discrete based is probably the best sounding architecture in the mixer you can get (bar the passive analog mixer but these are very hard to get/find and are ultra ‘no compromise’ stuff). For example: IC based analogs are DJR400, DN78 or Alpha9000, where fully discrete analogs are old bozak CMA, Condesa products (probably the best sounding mixers in the world right now) etc.

I guess it all comes down to how much you wanna spend on a mixer and also what signal you will be feeding into it (hot or cold).
As far as ‘cheapest rotary’ mixer – nothing can touch Omni. Nothing at all.

And then, from your 3.000 bucks mixer the output is fed into a (digital DSP) PA system that undoes most of the analogue goodness. Or, more likely, it is fed into a mono, loud but awful sounding ancient PA with drivers that are well past their prime. Or, also possible, you get to play your mobile gig on set of crappy no-name speakers that the band you are co-hosting the night with is using.

In short, unless you control the entire chain from vinyl/digital (wait, digital source material from your CD player through your analogue mixer?) to final PA system, I don’t think one component is gonna make the difference to be honest.

In my – as always totally personal and very humble – opinion, anything purist or audiophile has very little place in the modern DJ world, other than for your personal pleasure. No one will hire your sooner because you have an analogue mixer, no audience will show up at your gig rather than next door’s because you have a rotary mixer.

At the end of the day, that over-produced, over-compressed and mastered for digital playback dance track has been digital until the moment a DAC transfers into sound to go into your mixer. And no amount of quality will bring back such a track to life. And if I play ripped vinyl as a wav through my controller it still sounds like vinyl compared to it’s CD brother. My point being that there is so much you can’t control and most of the audience couldn’t care less anyway (I’ll save you a lecture on what happens to the sensitivity and frequency curve of your ears with increasing alcohol intake).

Not saying you shouldn’t get quality gear, but there is a level at which more (quality) is not gonna add value to your proposition, certainly not to a level that your customer (venue, corporation, wedding couple, etc.) is willing to pay for that increase in quality.

And as for rotary, to each his/her own. If you like rotary better, then indeed go for it.

Funny you should mention expensive XLR cables. We did a test in the studio once with “regular” bulk XLR cables from a reputable brand and some custom made cables that cost about 3 times as much.

We used the same length, they had the same connectors. We hooked up a really good mic (talking 2.000+ euro here) and did two recordings. One with each cable. We then did blind comparison. And you could EASILY hear the difference. Everyone in the room, including the proverbial cleaner, picked out the expensive cable. I really did not expect that much difference. I do believe that this big a difference can not be had when you upgrade your cable yet again though. Based mostly on the fact that at some point using thicker/more copper wire is not going to result in a comparable increase in signal quality and also because one of the things that made the custom ones better was the quality of the actual soldering of the cable to the connectors. But I might be wrong.

I am not sure if your statement about the hearing nerve holds true. Digital assumes that an audio value (containing information on frequency and volume at any given time) is translated at one end into ones and zero’s, transported in on/off electrical pulses and translated back at the end into a replica of the original waveform. As far as my knowledge goes, the brain is digital in that the synapsis in the brain either fire or they don’t. So also an on/off system of sorts. However, I think the ear creates an actual analogue electrical signal that isn’t on/off but just fluctuates in “voltage”. In other words the ear has no DAC so to speak. Any translation to “digital” would take place in the brain itself.

Interesting indeed 😀

Can’t. Dutch company that made them for the studio. Never got their information as I wasn’t looking for that grade of cables for myself.